Stopper and Closer

[scottsdale_joe]

Anyone ever tried naming both a stopper AND a closer?
I'd be interested in how that would work.
I suspect the already insanely overchallenged AI would make a mess of it.

[RonCo]

I'm using:

Macias: Closer
Souza: Setup/Stopper
Alvarado: MR/Closer
Oliver: MR/Stopper

And it seems to be doing fairly well.

[usnspecialist]

Anyone ever tried naming both a stopper AND a closer?
I'd be interested in how that would work.
I suspect the already insanely overchallenged AI would make a mess of it.

I did briefly in 2033 using Dan Estrada as the stopper. He usually ended up working 2+ innings every appearance and would sometimes get the save but most of the time yielded to the closer (who rotated).

[bpbrooksy]

I tried this last year because I had no bullpen and nothing to lose. I named Alfredo Martinez the stopper and Domingo Ayala the closer.

Martinez pitched 204.1 innings, took 15 losses, got 17 saves, and struck out 238, for a grand total of 0.0 WAR and an 82 ERA+. Meanwhile, Ayala pitched 45.1 innings, saved 11 games, had a 4.96 ERA and was worth 0.5 WAR despite a barely-higher 85 ERA+. Mostly, it seemed as though the game threw Martinez into any remotely close late-inning situation and let him go the distance. If he needed to be bailed out, Ayala came in as the sort of stopper for the stopper. The game definitely prioritized the stopper role and Martinez almost led the league in strikeouts.

[scottsdale_joe]

Interesting
Thanks.

[RonCo]

One thing to note is that last year was on v18. The history of OOTP features basically says:

Year 1: Highly erratic
Year 2: Workable with some problems
Year 3: Fairly stable (but folks don't realize it because they're conditioned to Year 1 problems)

This would say that v19 will be okay and v20 much stronger.

[recte44]

I did use a stopper- they ended up overusing the guy.

[RonCo]

Here's my team's pitches/outing this year so far. By pitcher, by role:

2035-YS9-PUsage.PNG (36.53 KiB) Viewed 1217 times

[scottsdale_joe]

One thing to note is that last year was on v18. The history of OOTP features basically says:
Year 1: Highly erratic
Year 2: Workable with some problems
Year 3: Fairly stable (but folks don't realize it because they're conditioned to Year 1 problems)
This would say that v19 will be okay and v20 much stronger.

Features may get better, I agree.
AI not so much.
Not complaining, as I understand the challenges of AI having worked in IT for 50 years, just saying.

[RonCo]

I understand the challenges of AI having worked in IT for 50 years, just saying.

I dabbled in it, too. So, yes, I know.

Still, I'm fairly happy with the decisions the AI's been making with handling the bullpen over a month of games. Biggest issues I have are in the handedness/platoon choices more often than not. I have a sabermetric manager and peg my strategies to focus on maintaining the platoon advantage, but it still seems to pick the "wrong" guy about 25% of the time.

[RonCo]

And I use the "stopper" as a feature because that role was only recently introduced, so it'll have some weirdness to iron out before it hits whatever it's stable state will be.

[RonCo]

I tried this last year because I had no bullpen and nothing to lose. I named Alfredo Martinez the stopper and Domingo Ayala the closer.

Martinez pitched 204.1 innings, took 15 losses, got 17 saves, and struck out 238, for a grand total of 0.0 WAR and an 82 ERA+. Meanwhile, Ayala pitched 45.1 innings, saved 11 games, had a 4.96 ERA and was worth 0.5 WAR despite a barely-higher 85 ERA+. Mostly, it seemed as though the game threw Martinez into any remotely close late-inning situation and let him go the distance. If he needed to be bailed out, Ayala came in as the sort of stopper for the stopper. The game definitely prioritized the stopper role and Martinez almost led the league in strikeouts.

This workload for a stopper in itself isn't too bad as a max-case. Mike Marshall appeared in 106 games as a stopper for the Dodgers, pitching 208 innings. Now, a major difference is that Marshall was actually a good pitcher (15-12, 21 saves, 2.42 ERA). He threw 179 innings in 96 games the year prior. Regardless, the "stopper" role is essentially defined as a guy who will come in and pitch 2-4 innings if needed. So if you tell the game to do that, then don't be massively shocked when it happens.

[Fat Nige]

I use a stopper but generally with high stamina relievers as ootp does tend to put him in for the two innings all the time if you’ve set it to ‘8 & later’

[Ted]

I don't use any roles, but my high leverage guys get the same kind of pattern you see with stopper. Both of them have high stamina for relievers. I wonder how much more we are going to need to look at that.

[usnspecialist]

I don't use any roles, but my high leverage guys get the same kind of pattern you see with stopper. Both of them have high stamina for relievers. I wonder how much more we are going to need to look at that.

the real question is WWMD. What Would Matheny Do?

[Ted]

I don't use any roles, but my high leverage guys get the same kind of pattern you see with stopper. Both of them have high stamina for relievers. I wonder how much more we are going to need to look at that.

the real question is WWMD. What Would Matheny Do?

Hopefully get run over by the team bus.