Montreal/Omaha

[handaspencer]

After being sent to the UMEBA via waivers Manuel Pena marched into GM Spencer office and demanded a trade. He granted his request and is sending him to Omaha.

Montreal will receive 500k in bonus fund money.

[niles08]

Omaha accepts...

Please put Pena in the 4th spot in the rotation that Is open.

[RonCo]

Justin continues to prove the Hawks aren't afraid to fiddle with their finances.

[niles08]

Justin continues to prove the Hawks aren't afraid to fiddle with their finances.

Well..When you lose 2 of your starting pitchers a month into the season with zero viable depth you gotta do something.

[RonCo]

you could agree to just lose a few games.

[niles08]

you could agree to just lose a few games.

Nahhh

[usnspecialist]

Is this deal even legal with how far over cap omaha is/will be?

[RonCo]

Technically, Omaha can be over cap as long as they pay the fine. Which will be pretty extreme at this point, but I suspect Justin will find a way.

[niles08]

Is this deal even legal with how far over cap omaha is/will be?

For what its worth, Anderson is on waivers and Chavez probably will be as well...and besides, Omaha had $53,000,000 in profit last year so my bonus funds are full so if I have to pay the fine a sim or two until I figure out how to maneuver this then so be it.

[Ted]

First off, I want to make it clear I don't think Justin is doing anything wrong. The rules are what they are. I'd just make an argument that the rules about being over the cap aren't harsh enough. Justin will pay something like 4.6 mil this sim if I did the math right. You could do that 8 or nine sims with full bonus funds. That's a third of season a team can operate 15 mil over the cap. That's a win or two if spent on the right players. So a team can simply max their bonus funds every year, and play over the cap and add 1-2 wins. Math is ballpark, but so are win estimates for players added. Lots of variance in fines and salary here. That's a huge advantage for already good teams that make money.

The fines either need to be raised, or better, we need to be fining at the current rate AND benching the the team's players (best player, commish's pick or enough players until the benched guys get them under the cap, etc)) until they are under the cap again. Otherwise, it's just room to play at an advantage compered to other teams (Admittedly with some mild future repercussions).

Again, no criticism of Justin here. He's just operating in the framework of the current rules and working around his injuries with available resources.

[niles08]

First off, I want to make it clear I don't think Justin is doing anything wrong. The rules are what they are. I'd just make an argument that the rules about being over the cap aren't harsh enough. Justin will pay something like 4.6 mil this sim if I did the math right. You could do that 8 or nine sims with full bonus funds. That's a third of season a team can operate 15 mil over the cap. That's a win or two if spent on the right players. So a team can simply max their bonus funds every year, and play over the cap and add 1-2 wins. Math is ballpark, but so are win estimates for players added. Lots of variance in fines and salary here. That's a huge advantage for already good teams that make money.

The fines either need to be raised, or better, we need to be fining at the current rate AND benching the the team's players (best player, commish's pick or enough players until the benched guys get them under the cap, etc)) until they are under the cap again. Otherwise, it's just room to play at an advantage compered to other teams (Admittedly with some mild future repercussions).

Again, no criticism of Justin here. He's just operating in the framework of the current rules and working around his injuries with available resources.

When I say Anderson is on waivers I mean hes cleared them and actually been released per my team news feed...so I actually am about $8 M over right now with Pena and should be fined roughly $1.6 M until I figure out what to do with Chavez.

[niles08]

I haven't seen anyone really tinker with this since I've been here so I guess I'll be the hamster on the wheel testing it out as far as the impact it could have on finances.

For what its worth I spent $63,000,000 on IFA during the offseason so already needed to plan on a bit of my bonus money to even me out this coming offseason.

My overall profit last season was $53,000,000 as I spent $0 on IFA and very little on draft fees but also have ticket prices near the top of the BBA

[RonCo]

Yep. Omaha was $6M over last sim, so they've already been accounted with $1.1M in fines. Running a little over cap and burning bonus funds is workable plan, but it can't be run for very long. It's not the best way to use your bonus funds...

And a majority of the league doesn't have a gajillion $ of bonus funds available. To me, the league design is great this way.

So, overall, my view here is ... meh. As a Heartland opponent, I'm pretty pleased to see Omaha burning though their bonus funds this way.

[niles08]

For what its worth... Chavez just was traded...and Anderson is released so that leaves me under the cap.

[usnspecialist]

i was just asking because I remember when I made the wilfer/Moreno trade a few years ago, we had to adjust it because of Huntsville being over cap....

viewtopic.php?f=31&t=22088

Understood that Justin has made corresponding moves (after my initial post), and that the penalty is just a fine, but why wasn't that standard applied back then?

[Ted]

Yep. Omaha was $6M over last sim, so they've already been accounted with $1.1M in fines. Running a little over cap and burning bonus funds is workable plan, but it can't be run for very long. It's not the best way to use your bonus funds...

And a majority of the league doesn't have a gajillion $ of bonus funds available. To me, the league design is great this way.

So, overall, my view here is ... meh. As a Heartland opponent, I'm pretty pleased to see Omaha burning though their bonus funds this way.

Why is a design great if a loophole can be exploited only by a small percentage of teams? It might turn out this is the best way to use bonus funds. I doubt anyone will ever do it, but you could essentially play at 115-116 million an for an entire season. So rich teams can have a higher cap if they so choose?

I mean, that's probably a much better use than dumping money into IFA. All I need is to make 27 mil in profit and I can have a 115 mil cap? Done. Eat it suckers. California's cap will be higher than yours next year.

[niles08]

Yep. Omaha was $6M over last sim, so they've already been accounted with $1.1M in fines. Running a little over cap and burning bonus funds is workable plan, but it can't be run for very long. It's not the best way to use your bonus funds...

And a majority of the league doesn't have a gajillion $ of bonus funds available. To me, the league design is great this way.

So, overall, my view here is ... meh. As a Heartland opponent, I'm pretty pleased to see Omaha burning though their bonus funds this way.

Why is a design great if a loophole can be exploited only by a small percentage of teams? It might turn out this is the best way to use bonus funds. I doubt anyone will ever do it, but you could essentially play at 115-116 million an for an entire season. So rich teams can have a higher cap if they so choose?

I mean, that's probably a much better use than dumping money into IFA. All I need is to make 27 mil in profit and I can have a 115 mil cap? Done. Eat it suckers. California's cap will be higher than yours next year.

This entire thing was discussed over when I brought up a luxury tax or revenue sharing idea a few weeks back in a poll and I was instantly shut down that I was a moron basically.

More discussion can be found here...

viewtopic.php?f=20&t=27505&p=155536#p155536

[recte44]