Relocation

[udlb58]

So, just to clarify. I cannot move the Moonshiners this year because I don't have the required 100 PPs. I would be able to pay 50 PP this year, and then move next year when I make my final payment of 50 PPs, correct?

[Ted]

I think there may also be a tenure requirement, (which you might have after this season anyway)

[trmmilwwi]

I read the specifics which can be found here and....

Team relocation utilizes the Ballpark Construction main ideas and yes, the payment can be split. Recte needs to confirm buy I think 2 years of 50PP will be allowed. The first payment and then 1 year later the second. Also see the financial cost of $50M plus add ons.

[trmmilwwi]

dola: Have fun with it... can't wait to see where Greenville ends up moving!

[recte44]

Yes, after re-reading this you can split the payment.

[Chey]

That said, I'm not sure why you would. Splitting the financial payment might make sense if you think your owner will just pocket your cashola, but PPs just sit there. What's the advantage to putting up a downpayment?

[udlb58]

I read the specifics which can be found here and....

Team relocation utilizes the Ballpark Construction main ideas and yes, the payment can be split. Recte needs to confirm buy I think 2 years of 50PP will be allowed. The first payment and then 1 year later the second. Also see the financial cost of $50M plus add ons.

Ugh, yeah I'm aware of the financial cost. But the yearly payments should be less than we have to currently pay in stadium fees, and the bump in loyalty/market will help out.



Crappy thing is, I only meet one of the 6 relocation criteria:

• Fan interest 60 or less [I raised fan interest over 60 with our pre-ASG run in first place, and it has stayed over 60 because we didn't really have any big names to lose that would piss off fans]
• Fan loyalty “Slightly Above Average” or less [shockingly over 'slightly above average']
• Market size “Average” or less [even more shockingly, it's above 'average'; side note; how the hell does a team with solid FI, a decent market, and supposedly more loyal than most fans only generate revenues of ~$95-98 million on a yearly basis?]
• Five consecutive losing seasons [nope, 5 of the last 6 with a .440 win% over thos 6, but there was that pesky playoff appearance in 2022]
• Team not profitable over the previous three seasons [nope; this team has lost money 13 of the last 18 years with losses totaling more than $83 million, but they turned a profit in 2024]
• Attendance less than 65% of stadium capacity in both the previous two seasons [ding, ding, ding, ding, ding! (barely) 2026: 63%, 2025: 44%]

[udlb58]

That said, I'm not sure why you would. Splitting the financial payment might make sense if you think your owner will just pocket your cashola, but PPs just sit there. What's the advantage to putting up a downpayment?

Because I don't have 100 PPs?

[RonCo]

Crappy thing is, I only meet one of the 6 relocation criteria:

• Fan interest 60 or less [I raised fan interest over 60 with our pre-ASG run in first place, and it has stayed over 60 because we didn't really have any big names to lose that would piss off fans]
• Fan loyalty “Slightly Above Average” or less [shockingly over 'slightly above average']
• Market size “Average” or less [even more shockingly, it's above 'average'; side note; how the hell does a team with solid FI, a decent market, and supposedly more loyal than most fans only generate revenues of ~$95-98 million on a yearly basis?]
• Five consecutive losing seasons [nope, 5 of the last 6 with a .440 win% over thos 6, but there was that pesky playoff appearance in 2022]
• Team not profitable over the previous three seasons [nope; this team has lost money 13 of the last 18 years with losses totaling more than $83 million, but they turned a profit in 2024]
• Attendance less than 65% of stadium capacity in both the previous two seasons [ding, ding, ding, ding, ding! (barely) 2026: 63%, 2025: 44%]

Perhaps the concept could be re-defined a bit to be a little less "absolute" in the definition, but clear in the idea that a team has to be struggling to qualify to move?

[Chey]

That said, I'm not sure why you would. Splitting the financial payment might make sense if you think your owner will just pocket your cashola, but PPs just sit there. What's the advantage to putting up a downpayment?

Because I don't have 100 PPs?

Yeah, but if you get 50 more you'll have 100 next off-season. Why pay 50 now and 50 then when you can just pay 100 then? Who knows, you might change your mind over the next couple months and it costs you absolutely nothing to pay it all in a lump sum a year from now.

[agrudez]

Crappy thing is, I only meet one of the 6 relocation criteria:

• Fan interest 60 or less [I raised fan interest over 60 with our pre-ASG run in first place, and it has stayed over 60 because we didn't really have any big names to lose that would piss off fans]
• Fan loyalty “Slightly Above Average” or less [shockingly over 'slightly above average']
• Market size “Average” or less [even more shockingly, it's above 'average'; side note; how the hell does a team with solid FI, a decent market, and supposedly more loyal than most fans only generate revenues of ~$95-98 million on a yearly basis?]
• Five consecutive losing seasons [nope, 5 of the last 6 with a .440 win% over thos 6, but there was that pesky playoff appearance in 2022]
• Team not profitable over the previous three seasons [nope; this team has lost money 13 of the last 18 years with losses totaling more than $83 million, but they turned a profit in 2024]
• Attendance less than 65% of stadium capacity in both the previous two seasons [ding, ding, ding, ding, ding! (barely) 2026: 63%, 2025: 44%]

Perhaps the concept could be re-defined a bit to be a little less "absolute" in the definition, but clear in the idea that a team has to be struggling to qualify to move?

To clarify, you can move even if you don't meet any of the above. Meeting 3 of those conditions merely qualifies you for the double increase of the fan/market attributes.

[udlb58]

That said, I'm not sure why you would. Splitting the financial payment might make sense if you think your owner will just pocket your cashola, but PPs just sit there. What's the advantage to putting up a downpayment?

Because I don't have 100 PPs?

Yeah, but if you get 50 more you'll have 100 next off-season. Why pay 50 now and 50 then when you can just pay 100 then? Who knows, you might change your mind over the next couple months and it costs you absolutely nothing to pay it all in a lump sum a year from now.

Right, but Matt just clarified that it is possible to pay 50 now and move immediately, and pay the remaining 50 the next offseason. So, that would be the only reason. Had he said no, you can't move until all 100 are paid, then I most certainly wouldn't have done it this year.

[recte44]

Yeah, I dont have a problem with splitting PP payment in this case.
\

[udlb58]

Crappy thing is, I only meet one of the 6 relocation criteria:

• Fan interest 60 or less [I raised fan interest over 60 with our pre-ASG run in first place, and it has stayed over 60 because we didn't really have any big names to lose that would piss off fans]
• Fan loyalty “Slightly Above Average” or less [shockingly over 'slightly above average']
• Market size “Average” or less [even more shockingly, it's above 'average'; side note; how the hell does a team with solid FI, a decent market, and supposedly more loyal than most fans only generate revenues of ~$95-98 million on a yearly basis?]
• Five consecutive losing seasons [nope, 5 of the last 6 with a .440 win% over thos 6, but there was that pesky playoff appearance in 2022]
• Team not profitable over the previous three seasons [nope; this team has lost money 13 of the last 18 years with losses totaling more than $83 million, but they turned a profit in 2024]
• Attendance less than 65% of stadium capacity in both the previous two seasons [ding, ding, ding, ding, ding! (barely) 2026: 63%, 2025: 44%]

Perhaps the concept could be re-defined a bit to be a little less "absolute" in the definition, but clear in the idea that a team has to be struggling to qualify to move?

To clarify, you can move even if you don't meet any of the above. Meeting 3 of those conditions merely qualifies you for the double increase of the fan/market attributes.

Right, but is there any better of an example of a team that needs to move than Greenville? We have the 3rd fewest franchise wins, t-2nd fewest playoff appearances, t-fewest LMS wins, and even when we've been respectable over the past 30 years, we've struggled to turn a profit.

I'm just saying that if you polled the GMs asking which team should relocate and even had None as an option, it would probably be a close race between Greenville and Tucson. Yet, we damn near were forced to take a penalty for moving, had our season not tanked the last 2 months, with attendance tanking along with it (going into August, we were averaging over 29,000 per game; 65% capacity is 29,250). I'm thinking the loyalty and market size requirements need to be looked at. We are far above both but were 5th worst in attendance (despite reasonable ticket prices, a solid FI, and a team that was in first from April-July), 6th worst in season ticket sales, 6th worst in merchandising, and t-2nd worst in media revenue.

[felipe]

Yeah, I'd move you both

Very poorly run franchises

[nerfHerder]

Yeah, I'd move you both

Very poorly run franchises

This comment is why you are the genius!

[Chey]

I mean, Buffalo when I came in actually met like 4 or 5 of the six (I don't remember exactly). You're kind of unlucky in that you just miss a bunch of them, but trust me, it could be worse.

[agrudez]

I'm thinking the loyalty and market size requirements need to be looked at. We are far above both but were 5th worst in attendance (despite reasonable ticket prices, a solid FI, and a team that was in first from April-July), 6th worst in season ticket sales, 6th worst in merchandising, and t-2nd worst in media revenue.

So you're in a better spot than most in terms of potential ticket draw? There are plenty of teams that would like to be above average in both of those things. Winning games will do far more for your revenue than moving your team. Also, maybe a quick consideration to "reasonable ticket prices" may be in order as well.

[udlb58]

I'm thinking the loyalty and market size requirements need to be looked at. We are far above both but were 5th worst in attendance (despite reasonable ticket prices, a solid FI, and a team that was in first from April-July), 6th worst in season ticket sales, 6th worst in merchandising, and t-2nd worst in media revenue.

So you're in a better spot than most in terms of potential ticket draw? There are plenty of teams that would like to be above average in both of those things. Winning games will do far more for your revenue than moving your team. Also, maybe a quick consideration to "reasonable ticket prices" may be in order as well.

What's reasonable? I don't even know what the hell we're charging right now, I haven't seen where this is editable in game and as was discussed some time ago, we can't see what other teams are charging so even if I was completely aware of what I was charging, I wouldn't know how that compares to everyone else. How would raising ticket prices help when you are only drawing 60% of capacity, won't higher ticket prices also result in fewer tickets sold and less merch sold?

Moving the stadium was mainly about:
1) It getting close to the time that it would be smart to have a new stadium built
2) I will be re-branding this team in some way, it has a history of being shit, no team in real life would suck for 30 years without some sort of re-branding to try and drum up interest (except the Browns)
3) If I'm going to be building a new stadium and re-branding, why not also consider relocation and get the branding for "free"?

[Lane]

Ticket prices should be on the main front office page. There exists a list of MBBA ticket prices somewhere but I don't have the link handy. I think Kyle is probably suggesting you lower your ticket prices to improve attendance? Not sure.

However, a lot of franchises in this league have moved and I see no reason why you shouldn't if you want to. Great point about the historical success of Greenville. I say go for it!


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